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 Post subject: BMW Engined Haflinger
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:08 am 
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Location: Canberra Australia
My neighbour has a BMW R100 boxer bike and I have always thought the engine would possibly fit into a Haflinger. The exhaust are in the wrong spot and in the carb versions they are also in the wrong spot but the fuel injection gets around that - all workable.

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r100gs-cutaway.jpg
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However the main issue is the huge sump cavity that hangs down from the engine which would reduce clearance under the rear of a Haffie. In discussion on a Landrover forum a member indictated they once had a Haflinger with a boxer BMW R100 engine in the back. He said that mating it up to the haflinger gearbox was not a big issue and it ran very well. With a double the power of a Haflinger and a 6500rpm redline the Haf had a top speed of over 70mph but if not careful the gearbox would not handle the power.

To get around the clearance issue he removed the sump and replaced it with flat plate and converted it dry sump - apparently easy. The BMW oil cooler was mounted under the front bumper in a neat arrangement and with the system full of oil everything works fine.

Unfortunately he did not have any good quality pics of the arrangement - here is one from the rear with the lower engine just visble.
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And a pic of the front with the oil cooler - again poor quality as they are scans of old happy snaps.
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!cid_image015_jpg@01D35682.jpg
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Thanks to Rory for the pics.

While I would not ever consider converting my vehicle - if I acquired a wreck that was not worth restoring, then yes. But then maybe a Subaru dual range engine, gearbox and transaxle to replace the Haf unit :-)

Garry

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:47 am 
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The other issue that would need to be addressed is cooling. Whilst the Dynastart fan and shroud provide most of the cooling, the BMW engine was designed to run in the open air. The fan blown air as done by Haflinger would cool mainly the top surfaces of the barrels but the undersides would suffer with less cooling especially at low speeds offroad when the engine was working harder, but air speeds slower. Again not insurmountable, but something to think about.'

The Subaru setup would needs some thought on how to link to the front diff and by this time you would be building a "very" modified offroader and would it still be a Haf?

Shame about the photos, would have been nice to see things in more detail.

John

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Last edited by heinkeljb on Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Made it clearer which engine is being talked about!


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:34 am 
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Yes he did rig up intake fans that sucked in air through the rear door blowing over the fins and out the bottom.

On the Subaru arrangement you just use the 4wd transaxle with the out put shaft connecting up with the drive shaft in the Haflinger centre centre chassis tube. The main issue would be trying the get the WRX 2.5litre turbo in the engine bay :evil:

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:11 pm 
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Getting the Subaru engine in the engine bay would be no peoblem at all - there won’t be a engine bay! You would have to cut off the two engine bay side covers as the engine would be too wide to fit in there. You would be using the trans axle so to platform support tower would have to be made from scratch to fit. So basically the back end of the Haflinger platform would just be the top surface / engine hatch!!!

Jonn

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:49 pm 
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An interesting post and photos Garry!

Like many I'm sure I've toyed with the idea of transplanting a more powerful engine in to the Haflinger. I've thought about BMW, Moto-Guzzi, Honda, Volkswagen and Kohler - generally flat or V-twin. A bit more power and a higher top-speed would be nice.

What has tended to put me off is the potential for cooling issues that John has referenced above and also, unless the engine revs significantly higher than the Haflinger unit there isn't a lot of point, it's the revs and gearing that govern the speed. Drive train durability would also be a concern.

For what I use mine for the current set-up works well and meets 90% of my on/off-road needs, so I have managed to restrain myself (so far) - I do love seeing and hearing about conversions though!


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 3:11 am 
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heinkeljb wrote:
Getting the Subaru engine in the engine bay would be no peoblem at all - there won’t be a engine bay! You would have to cut off the two engine bay side covers as the engine would be too wide to fit in there. You would be using the trans axle so to platform support tower would have to be made from scratch to fit. So basically the back end of the Haflinger platform would just be the top surface / engine hatch!!!

Jonn


Optimism is the father of invention :lol: Though when I was working as a senior manager I always believed my pessimistic staff over the optimists as the final delivered project was always closer to that of the pessimist ;)

The earlier Subaru engines are only a little wider than a Haf engine so width wise there is not an issue - but being 4cylinder the engine is twice as long.

Here is a haf with a subaru engine (1400cc I think)
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Subaru engine 2.jpg
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Attachment:
Subaru engine 3.jpg
Subaru engine 3.jpg [ 254.64 KiB | Viewed 182 times ]


Is too long though
Attachment:
Subaru engine 1.jpg
Subaru engine 1.jpg [ 230 KiB | Viewed 182 times ]


Easy Peasy - hmm I have a spare Haf chassis tube - next project ?????? 8-)

Garry

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Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 3:35 am 
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jhon wrote:
unless the engine revs significantly higher than the Haflinger unit there isn't a lot of point, it's the revs and gearing that govern the speed. Drive train durability would also be a concern.


That is why bike engines are a good option - they have a much higher redline and operating RPM so will better suited the standard Haff gearing where just a bigger car style engine with similar revs to a Haf engine will only provide more grunt not speed.

This is where the dual range 5 speed Subaru transaxle comes in - same basic design as the Haf transaxle bit higher gears with high and low range as low gears as the Haf. - I think the harderst thing will be to get a diff lock into the rear diff.

See thought of everything 8-)

Garry

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Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
Landrover Series 1 SWB (57)
Jaguar E-type Roadster V12 (71)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:04 am 
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I had a 1400cc Citreon AX diesel in my Haf and loved it. Can't take the credit for the initial fit-up, Andrew Davidson was the brains behind that and fitted it for me. I did a lot of tweaking afterwards, but basically got really good use out of it for around 10 years or more.
For me, it transformed the vehicle. The Haf didn't really go any faster, but could easily pull away in third (later 5 speed model), and could traverse rough ground at tickover in third and a quick squirt would shoot it up the steepest hills. It was great and never damaged the drivetrain.
Ground clearance wasn't really an issue, partly as I ran bigger tyres. The departure angle wasn't great and did cause the odd issue if I got stuck and had to reverse.
I put the radiator behind the front seats with a big electric fan.
Good times, like many things, wish I hadn't sold it..


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