Handbrakes

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AustHaflinger
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Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

After I put my brakes back to together after doing the hubs the hand brake would not work despite it being adjusted right up on the cable system I had put the leavers on the back hubs in the wrong position so even with the cable tight and handbrake on the adjusters in the brakes were just touching the brake shoes.

Easy I thought - just holder the adjuster in position and put the leavers in the correct spot - no problem with the rear passenger side but the drivers side was having nothing of it with the adjuster slipping off over the top of the relevant section of the brake shoe arrangement. This was even when the shoes were adjusted up correctly against the brake drum. (The shoes have at least 1/4" of pad material) I noticed that when the drum came off there were fresh metal filings which seemed to have come from the adjuster area.

This is a pic of the adjuster in the off position.
Image

This is what happens when the hand brake is pulled - the adjuster slips over the top - note the little bit of rounding of the mating surfaces.
Image

Here is the other side - a much closer fit.
Image

So I am going to touch up the rounded faces with the welder and swap the two rear drums around to see if I can tighten up shoe to drum clearance and move the activating leaver that the brake cable pulls off a spline or two so that in the off position the activating cam is a bit clear of the shoe like on the other side.

Anything I have missed ?

Garry
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Goatwerks
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by Goatwerks »

In the last picture your lever return spring is not anchored to the ridge in the backing plate(this pulls the parts together and allows for proper adjustment) .
The top of the shoes will drag if the return spring is not anchored(your filings?)
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

Thanks for that Jim - missed that completely - was correct when I assembled the brakes as I had trouble getting the end of the spring into the slot. I just went out and put the spring end back into the slot and it popped straight back out - so maybe a little persuasion by bending it in will be required.

On the other side I took the actuator cam out and the tip is worn
Image

Image

The back of the brake shoe that the actuator moves against is also worn but it has been previously welded and ground back.
Image

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
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heinkeljb
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by heinkeljb »

Looks like weld is not a hard as the original metal then. More weld and re-grind to original shape (what ever that was). I had problems with the internal brake shoe return spring as well.

I think, it is because of the direction it is wound in, on the one side it tries to jump out of the casting because it comes from the inside towards the outside which leave the hook at a funny angle.

Hand brake seems to be another of those things the designers said "but we can do this to make it work" ......

John
Haflinger 703AP LWB 1973 - (Once owned by Lady Sutherland & Sons.) Now called "Lurch" !

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AustHaflinger
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

heinkeljb wrote:Hand brake seems to be another of those things the designers said "but we can do this to make it work" ......

John
I wasn't going to have a sook because I am concerned I will come across as being too critical, but I am of the same mind as you.

The circular spring that returns the handbrake lever on the rear hubs is a case in point - because it wrapped around the actuating shaft it is hard the get the bolt in that clamps up the lever and having it taken in and out so much and because the spring gets in the way I stripped the bolt head so ground it down to 10mm but the damage was done. So off to the local parts supplier and hardware store to get a couple of M7 1.0 bolts - nope that is not common is Australia and I could not get any - so a 20km drive to a specialist bolt supplier to get the bolts - equivalent of 50p for 4 but a 40km round trip. A circular spring could have been put on the square plate that is issued to adjust the wheel bearings on the back of the hub because where it is, it makes getting the clamping bolt in very difficult.

I am surprised not more development was not made to the Haflinger through its life.

However when it does go, the Haflinger is great - though today I did offer a mate to swap my Haflinger for his Subaru but he declined - whats more the Haflinger is worth twice his Subaru :)
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kerry460
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by kerry460 »

drill tap and fit a grease nipple to the backing plate where the handbrake shaft goes through
it helps a lot , just a tiny bit of grease stops the shaft binding

kerry
ex Tasmanian Haflinger agent .
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heinkeljb
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by heinkeljb »

Gary,

As you point out, not a lot of extra development work was done on the Haflinger towards the end. Kerry has just pointed out an easy "ongoing upgrade" that could have been implemented by the factory during the life on the production floor.

There again, I doubt they thought vehicles would still be around 40 years later and in use, maybe in a Museum.

I know I am critical of the design "flaws" of a Haflinger, but I still like driving around in it so I put up with them! There lots of other vehicles out there which have equally annoying design flaws, which I would be less inclined to put up with. Toyota Pruis and the "non-turn off ignition" a case in point.

Anyway, to get back to your brakes, Have you replaced things on both sides or only the side which has caused trouble?

John
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

Kerry - Thanks for the pointer - this is not an issue with my current problem as it is all greased up from my recent work but good for longer term maintenance.

I got the Mig out last night and filled the worn bits and filed them back smooth and will put the bits back in again - reinstall brake shoes :(

It is only the one side I have the problem with - I haven't measured the drum thickness and maybe that is the issue that they are worn but then they adjust up fine.

Cheers

Garry
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heinkeljb
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by heinkeljb »

Thinking back, if I remember correctly, you made a comment at one point about having to swap the brake drums because you couldn't fit one. That would suggest one side is more worn than the other.

Maybe due to incorrect adjustment previously? Maybe due to the issue you are having now with the handbrake and having to have one side adjusted up tighter than the other so the handbrake would work?

Do you have another brake drum / shoes? Does the handbrake cable move nicely in both halves of the outer cables?

Like most things on a Haflinger..... started off being something minor and has grown bigger and bigger! :o :lol:

John
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

Hi John - you may very well be right - in the ideal world I would just put in new drums and shoes but that isn't going to happen. The drums look Ok and there is a minimum of 1/4" on the shoes and the brakes adjust up fine and on the road the brakes work brilliantly - pulling up hard and straight.

The only issue seems to be just this one handbrake activation cam - I haven't reinstalled the shoes but I am hopeful the filling in the wear spots with weld will fix the issue - I will put on a small amount of grease in the wear point to provide a little lubrication.

Cheers

Garry
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kerry460
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by kerry460 »

Gary .
i would leave it dry so it does not attract dust dirt and worn brake shoe material .
i might be right or wrong , just a comment and personal opinion

cheers
kerry
ex Tasmanian Haflinger agent .
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

Thanks Kerry - yes a consideration.

The welding of the wear spots did the trick - handbrake works all fine now - thanks to everyone for the contributions.

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
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heinkeljb
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by heinkeljb »

As long as the amount of grease concerned is very small, the fact it will attract brake dust is not a big problem, it will still do the job of allowing the two parts to move against each other and slow down the wear that might take place.

Glad you have sorted it without requiring a new hub, as that begs the question - should you change both on an axle or is it alright just to change one? On a modern car, I would say change both sides along with new brake shoes, but as getting hold of "new" brake drums for a Haflinger might prove tricky, just changing one brake drum will have to suffice.

John
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Handbrakes

Post by AustHaflinger »

I think that technically you should do axle sets but with older vehicles the reality of life set in - if clearances are OK and each wheel will adjust up Ok then fine - certainly on a slow vehicle like a Haffie.

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
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