Poor Lurch - Engine making horrible noises!

[heinkeljb]

Loan engine. Gets Lurch mobile and allows me time to find all the replacement parts which will probably take some time.

John

[jhon]

Did you get a carb with it John or are you using the one fitted to your original engine? It's not much bigger at 700cc but the carburation may be slightly different from standard depending on compression, etc. Just something to bear in mind if it doesn't run right.

I'm interested to know if you notice any difference in power/torque!

[heinkeljb]

Had the engine running this evening. Had to tighten the Dynastart belts by one washer from the setting I had on Lurch in order to get it to turn the engine over... more compression than Lurch had.

Carb is from Lurch's engine but we have had a play with carburation when we had it running on the bench.

Engine still needs running in, so will take it for a short drive tomorrow evening after work to check things work and it doesn't start leaking oil or petrol or dies because of a loose connection or something! Then it is a question of lots of several shortish journeys building up the distances.

I have had to fight and bend a few things to make it all go back together again. Lurch never had the rubber seals round the engine tin work, so I put them it - what a pain trying to get the engine in with them getting in the way. Biggest issue was the rear closing bar - it fitted without the engine is place and appeared to be in the correct place. With the engine in, the tin work at the back did not want to line up with the closing piece with the rubber in place. So a bit of bending here and twisting there and it is together, but I noticed that it has put a kink into the left hand side engine tin work just below the cylinder head, but it is now too dark to look at it properly to see what has caused it and what can be done to solve it.

John

[jhon]

Excellent! You'll be delighted at getting it running again - pleased for you.

Mine doesn't have the rubber seals around the tinware and I wasn't bothered about it until I did a couple of miles on a dusty road and noticed that my secondary air filter was well clogged with dust and debris; all over the engine too. For off-road use I reckon it's worth the time and effort fitting them.

[AustHaflinger]

My carb is jetted the same as the standard engine and has no trouble with the larger engine so your standard carb should be OK.

Garry

[peter_m]

This is a copy of part of a 1990 Hafmag...The bearings are still going strong 28 yrs on. I will look out the part nos. and will post

[heinkeljb]

HI Peter,

That would be a very useful bit of information. I wonder what over sizes they are available in? The various crankshafts I have been offered are all very different in their states of wear, so in some cases the cranks are as scrap as my broken one!!

John

[peter_m]

I have dug out the original packet..don't forget this is 1990.

Glacier bearings part No.B4538SA 1.00mm for volkswagen..they are for a 1300 and 1600 VW Don't know whether it was the air or water cooled engine at this distance in time Also the box says AE autoparts Bradford

AEPB4538SA 1.00 Glacier bearing sets engine.

From what I remember they were 1mm undersize for a reground crank, that's the VW crank not the Haffy

https://www.ggbearings.com/en/company/h ... nufacturer

https://www.ebay.co.uk/b/VW-Beetle-Car- ... bn_1273130
AEPB4538SA 1.00 Glacier bearing

https://www.enginepartsuk.net/engine-be ... hes-shells

hope that this is of some use to everybody, do tell me how you get on if you use any of the information.

[peter_m]

30 years on it is sooo easy to source parts for HAfs, back in 1980-90 it was a real nightmare to find any spares at all, although Peter Ward had some bits he had been able to glean.

[peter_m]

probable teaching grannies and eggs etc. but I suppose yre governor was working O.K. and set to the correct speed?

[heinkeljb]

Yes the governor was working, limiting speed to ~43mph flat out. The crank appears to have been grind 2 sizes undersized on one of the journals and 1 size on the other.

It was a factory reconditioned engine in the 1980’s as it has no factory engine number stamped in the case, so it has a hand “punched” number using a centre punch.

It just appears the left big end journal snapped due to metal fatigue as the fracture is virtually through the oil hole in the big end journal looking at the picture. I will see it in person next time I go to Alf’s with a replacement crank.

John

[AustHaflinger]

Examine the crack and if it is bright all the way across then it was a "catastrophic" failure - instantaneous.

However if the crack is dull with a bright section then the crack has been growing for a long time (the dull section) weakening until it broke (the bright section). Look at the oil hole to see if it is countersunk, aids in oilflow but also helps stop cracks growing from the hole.

The other aspect to look for is if there are any burning (heat) marks on the journal or if there is any bearing material smeared on the journal indicating oil failure to the bearing (spun bearing) and grabbing the journal. In my Land Rover TDV6 they have a history of spinning a bearing on a big end grabbing the journal and snapping the crank - much like you have.

Also with journals machined to different sizes, there is always a chance wrong size bearings fitted (happened in a friends 3.9 Rover V8) ultimately resulted in engine failure but after many km). Given the age of your engine and its use, I doubt this is an issue but is worthwhile checking.

Cheers

Garry

[heinkeljb]

Busy running in the borrowed engine, If you thought a Haflinger was slow under normal circumstances, this is even slower! Still relatively easy as I am just driving around Lewes. Speed limits are 20 and 30 mph so as long as I don't go for racing starts, it seems an ideal way to do the running in. Constant engine rev changes, different loads depending on the terrain, Lewes has some hills...
So far have about 50 miles on it. When I hit 100, I'll do an oil and filter change.

John

[AustHaflinger]

Well at least you are back on the road.

[Ole]

Nice to hear Lurch is back and kicking.

John, do you have any tips on what is considered normal crank end play on these engines? I know the manual says 0,17-0,29mm.

Mine have a distinct clunk when pulling/pushing on the rear pulley and I can clearly see it move. From memory I measured it to something like 1,2mm. Not sure if this is reason for concern or just the way they are on their old days.

[heinkeljb]

It definitely should not have that amount of end float, but unless you at least take the engine out so you can make sure the flywheel is on properly, the only other thing could be the pulley wheel not being done up properly.
But it is far more likely to be the washers (shims) that are only accessibly with the crank cases apart which are at fault!
You could probably run the engine for ages as it stands, but sooner or later it is going to do something horrible inside the crank cases!!
One of the things that happens is the crankcase face where the flywheel is, becomes damaged and if really bad, scrap crank cases!

John

[Ole]

Thanks John, I will check the pulley wheel and measure again in case my memory is wrong.

[Julian B]

...I am not familiar with this DSS invalid carriage - do they use a haflinger engine? 500cc seems a bit small but has this engine have the same crank with a smaller bore to reduce to 500cc.

Not sure if this BBC video will play for those not in the UK, but it shows the Invacar - and at 03:10 even the Puch engine, complete with Dynastarter etc.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/stories-4 ... passengers

[AustHaflinger]

Thanks Julian - so they had to climb out of their chairs and get in - how did the chairs get in. We had something in Aust in the 80s based on a motor bike - it was a trike and you simply drove the wheel chair up the back between the rear wheels, stayed in the chair which was locked in and drove around still seated in your wheel chair.

I guess the Invacar in its design too its layout from those awful Robins, in fact when I first saw an Invacar I thought it was a Robin. What was the Brit fascination with 3 wheel cars in the 50s and 60s - three wheelers in most other places had the single wheel at the back and some stability but the Brit versions were single at the front and unstable.

Cheers

Garry

[Julian B]

What was the Brit fascination with 3 wheel cars in the 50s and 60s

Not sure if it is cause or effect, but three wheelers, whether it be an invalid carriage, Robin Reliant or the ever so groovy Bond Bug, only require a motorbike license to drive them, so it may have made them more accessible (paperwork-wise)?

Some did have a third wheel at the back, notably Morgans.