Centifugal Air Cleaner

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AustHaflinger
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Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by AustHaflinger »

I am into 4wding and am familiar with Snorkels and Remote Air Intakes on vehicles. The remote air intake on the front (called the Centrifugal Air Cleaner in the parts book) sort of is the opposite to a normal snorkel in that it points down, sucks through slots at the side and it not all that high up. Just turning it up the other way would give an extra 9" wading depth from the air intake perspective with little modification to the air intake system to let any water out.

I have not been able to find out much on why it is designed the way that it is - ie slits and turned down - can someone enlighten me on what the designers were attempting to achieve with its design. I am going to make a up a removable snorkel to to plug into the pipe so that when I do have to ford creeks the chance of sucking in water will be reduced.

Also - form your experience in fording - what happens if the water level gets up a bit and the engine cooling fan gets under water - does it deflect and cause damage or is OK and just changes the engine into a water cooled engine.

Cheers

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
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pathfinder700ap
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Location: Graz, Austria

Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by pathfinder700ap »

Hi there,

the cyclonic air filter sucks air through the three vents on the cylindric surface. This results in a swirl inside the cylinder. Because of the centrifugal force, particles are thrown to the cylinder walls and then fall down to the floor, while the cleaned air exits the filter through the top. Near the floor, there is a small slot through which the particles/dust can exit.

To sum it up: The filter may not be mounted upside down, because then it doesn't work at all.

On my Haf, the bottom of the filter (inside) was full of dirt, so the dust could not exit the filter any more through the small slot.


Kind regards,
Constantin
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heinkeljb
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by heinkeljb »

I have no idea what the designer(s) were thinking when they came up with the COMPLICATED / involved pipework to an air cleaner that is so far away from the engine.

All the joints in the pipe work are weak points which need checking to make sure they are not leaking.

My solution would be to make an elbow that allowed the air intake to exit via the lower engine hatch and then to go vertically to the height of the cab roof (much like an aerial / flag pole).

John
Haflinger 703AP LWB 1973 - (Once owned by Lady Sutherland & Sons.) Now called "Lurch" !

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AustHaflinger
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by AustHaflinger »

Thanks Constantin - explains the process well. It is certainly worth while sucking in fresh air at the front vs sucking in dusty air at the back cause by the vacuum at the rear of the vehicle. I only have the paper air filter on the engine at the moment and am looking to putting the oil bath back on (the one that came with my vehicle is not correct) an run the plumbing to the front air clearner.

Cheers

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
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pathfinder700ap
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by pathfinder700ap »

The problem is, that in the rear, the air is dusty because of the wheels running on sand or whatever. That's why on the so called "tropical version", the air intake is on the front, where the air should be cleaner. The cyclonic air filter is just a small add-on.

If you had a "snorkel" going up from the rear engine hatch, I think it would often be in the way, especially if you use the Haflinger as a pick-up truck.

Regards,
Constantin
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by AustHaflinger »

I agree about a snorkel at the rear - the centrifugal air cleaner comes off easy enough so i am going to make a flexible system that will just be connected when needed and raise the air intake up around the top the windscreen - definitely only to be put on when needed and carries with the spares in the back.

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
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HaffyHunter
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by HaffyHunter »

Hi Garry,
I've seen a few photos of Hafi's with snorkels fitted. Some have been at the rear like a stovepipe through the upper engine lid and some have been at the front that were done quite neatly to resemble the factory style of Jeeps and Land Rovers. Either way this never made much sense to me as the Haflinger was designed to ford waterways of no more than 20" (500mm). The thing is that even if you raise the air intake with a snorkel there are so many other components that will suffer from water damage that you would be unlikely to ever get it all waterproofed. Consider the following:
- Distributor and spark plug wires
- Ignition coil
- Voltage regulator
- Dynastarter and relay
- Air intake system connections in the engine compartment
- Engine oil cooler fins clogging from silt and mud collection
- Fuel tank with the vented cap
- Swing axle pivot joints
- Brake master cylinder
- Speedometer drive gear housing
- Diff lock actuator entry at housing
- Clutch plate and release bearing
Some of these points are splash proof if all components are in top nick and some just aren't waterproof at all. None are designed for total submersion. Besides, fording water any deeper than the front mounted air intake means that water will be at the height of the instrument panel electrics :shock: which is not at all good. Also you may well bend the blades of the engine cooling fan from their force against the water. Also consider what happens if the engine stalls in deep water...the water fills the exhaust system and backs up into the cylinder heads and combustion chambers to do all kinds of hydraulic and corrosion damage.
The Haflinger was designed to be capable of many amazing things but dealing with water is not one of them. If you plan on excursion with deep water crossings you should get a Pinzgauer as they are much better suited. I think Steyr Puch recognized these short comings in the Haflinger design when conceiving the Pinz.
Cheers,
Steve
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by AustHaflinger »

Hi Steve you are quite correct but the same argument applies to all offroad vehicles and for sure you need to understand what the critical components are in the vehicle. When fording the aim is to get a bow wave set up at the front which sucks water out from inder the vehicle, drastically lowering the water level under it. However with a Haffie creating a bow wave means the water just goes into the air intake at the front (as it does in most 4wds that have air intakes behind grills etc). Having a removable remote air intact will allow the vehicle to keep going and if it stops all bets are off - switch off, pull it out and let it dry. This remote air intake will be nothing more than some pvc plumbing pipe that can be plugged in. In my area, while not planned on, creek fording is a fact of life in the mountains when rain can quickly cause creeks to rise.

If I plan to go into deep water I will use my 101 - with difflocks a better all round vehicle than the Pinz.

By the way my Range Rover Sport at full offroad height also only has a 500mm fording depth an I have a RAI to go onto it.

Goes to show what can be done if a RAI is fitted - this has the same standard fording depth as the Haffie but has an RAI (not sure I would do this though with any of my vehicles)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-wC3uvXWmY


Another showing the adbantage of a RAI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3h3_IZWhX0g

Cheers

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
Landrover Series 1 SWB (57)
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walderse
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by walderse »

Hello to all,
Steve is quite correct that there are many components on the Halfinger that were never designed for total submersion. The factory recognized this and successfully tested a Series 1 truck equipped with inflatable cylindrical pontoons mounted to each side. The test pond was adjacent to the factory in Graz. The Australian Army also recognized the limitation and built a few pontoon-equipped Haflingers for active duty as well. The Austalians chose to build hollow box section wooden pontoons for their flotation chores.

As far as the cetrifugal air clear goes, I have seen the same filter attached to the oil bath air cleaners non-Tropical trucks. They are also oriented in a downward poisiton. One can also find a short snorkel tube on some trucks that raises the air intake to just under the top engine cover.

For those truly interested in deep water 4x4 play, the VW Typ166 is hard to beat...and much more expensive to buy.

Take care.

Jim Molloy
Waldersee Farm
http://www.northwestmogfest.com
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AustHaflinger
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by AustHaflinger »

I think some are missing my point - the aim is not to find the deepest hole and drive through it but to provide an additional layer of protection in case I have to. As I said - this is nothing to be fitted permanently but something to be carried with my recovery gear to be used if needed.

I cannot speak for other countries but snorkels are standard fit here on most 4wds - helps keep the dust out of the air intake and in water crossings help keep the water out.

Cheers

Garry
Haflinger 700AP (73)
Range Rover Sport TDV6 (07)
Landrover FC 101 (77)
Landrover Series 1 SWB Station Wagon (57)
Landrover Series 1 SWB (57)
Jaguar E-type Roadster V12 (71)
Jaguar XJ12C (76)
HaffyHunter
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Re: Centifugal Air Cleaner

Post by HaffyHunter »

Hi Garry,
I get your point and it applies to many types of vehicles. I too have done plenty of deep water crossings of streams and long swamp holes in a variety of vehicles. The thing is that the bow wave principle simply doesn't work well with Haflingers. They aren't powerful enough to sustain this and the body design doesn't help either. I've also found that the Haflinger isn't heavy enough to hold against a swift stream current and got tipped on my side which was embarrassing as heck since my buddy had just crossed ahead of me in his Toyota FJ without any incident. The water was only just over a foot deep but it was fast and the rocky stream bed was very slippery.
Cheers,
Steve
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